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  1. Standard memberno1marauder
    Naturally Right
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    20 Apr '24 15:301 edit
    Right wingers here are repeating the same nonsense they did a year ago that I debunked in this thread: https://www.redhotpawn.com/forum/debates/bonus-question%E2%80%A6.196665

    I also made some predictions, like a motion to dismiss on Statute of Limitations grounds, would be denied by the trial judge. It was here: https://casetext.com/case/people-v-trump-20

    But as a reminder:

    Despite what Average Joe keeps repeating, DA Bragg did not charge Donald Trump with a Federal crime. He charged him with 34 counts of this one:

    NY Penal Law "§ 175.10 Falsifying business records in the first degree. A person is guilty of falsifying business records in the first degree when he commits the crime of falsifying business records in the second degree, and when his intent to defraud includes an intent to commit another crime or to aid or conceal the commission thereof. Falsifying business records in the first degree is a class E felony."

    As to the object crimes, Bragg is basing the "intent to commit another crime" which elevates the charge from a misdemeanor 2nd Degree to a felony First Degree Falsifying business records, Bragg uses three theories any one of which the Judge found adequate to sustain the charges at this point (a fourth was rejected):

    "(1) The People allege that Defendant "violated federal election laws because the payoffs to both McDougal and Daniels violated FECA's restrictions on corporate and individual contributions." People's (Apposition pg. 24 The People presented evidence to the Grand Jury that Cohen pled guilty in the Southern District of New York to violating FECA for engaging in the very acts which are at issue here, i.e. making unlawful campaign contributions and that he did so at the direction of, and in coordination with, "a candidate for federal office," later identified as Donald J. Trump - the Defendant herein.
    (2) Under the second theory, the People allege that Defendant intended to violate N.Y. Election Law § 17 152 by conspiring to "promote the election of any person to a public office...by entering a scheme specifically for purposes of influencing the 2016 presidential election; and that they did so by 'unlawfull means,' including by violating FECA through the unlaw individual and corporate contributions by Cohen. Pecker, and AMI; and...by falsifying the records of other New York enterprises and mischaracterizing the. nature of the repayment for tax purposes." People's Opposition at pg. 25.
    (3) Under die third theory, the People allege that the Defendant intended to violate New York fax Law §§ 1801(a)(3) and 1802. this theory is premised on evidence introduced to the Grand Jury that when Cohen was reimbursed for the $1.30,000 payment he made to Daniels, the amount he received was "grossed up" to compensate him for taxes he would have to pay on the reimbursement."

    "The Court has considered the respective arguments of the parties and finds that the evidence presented to the Grand Jury for the first three theories was legally sufficient to support the intent to commit the "other crime" element of falsifying Business Records in the first Degree."

    https://casetext.com/case/people-v-trump-20 pp. 13-14

    Finally, the Statute of Limitations defense was rejected as I predicted though on grounds I hadn't thought of:

    "Although conduct described in the Indictment occurred more than five years prior to the filing of the Indictment, the Governor's Orders tolled "any specific time limit for the commencement" of any felony through May 6, 2021. Thus, the deadline for the prosecution of the alleged conduct was extended by one year and 47 days. In other words, this felony prosecution had to be commenced within 6 years and 47 days from when the crimes were allegedly committed. The earliest conduct described in the Indictment allegedly occurred on February 14, 2017. The tolled period or extension for commencing the action thus brought the conduct described in the Indictment within the prescribed five-year time limit.

    Since the Court finds the Indictment was timely brought as a result of the tolling occasioned by the Governor's Executive Orders, it declines to address the People's other theory pursuant to CPI- § 30.10(4)(a)(1), that the filing deadline was also extended because Defendant was continuously out of New York."

    p. 24

    Hope that helps.
  2. SubscriberRuss
    RHP Code Monkey
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    22 Apr '24 14:07
    A fairly significant web site update is about to land soon. If you would like to help test this beta, you can preview it right now at Beta.RedHotPawn.com.

    Please login, just do your normal thing, and provide any feedback to :

    Thread 199493

    Thanks!
  3. Standard memberspruce112358
    Democracy Advocate
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    19 Apr '24 19:46
    @averagejoe1 said
    I’m a bit confused.
    Well, go take a nap. πŸ™‚
  4. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
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    18 Apr '24 04:58
    A deliberate tactic?
    YouTube
    His gag order says no attacking the jury and others or reposting.
    We will find out tomorrow what the judge will do. How can he not through this cretin in jail?
  5. Subscribershavixmir
    Guppy poo
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    18 Apr '24 12:57
    @averagejoe1 said
    Because Trump is being improperly accused. Have you seen the news on it? Bragg has no jurisdiction with regard to a Federal law, and the misdemeanor's Statute of Limitations has run.
    It was refreshing to see a normal question from the sonhouse. Thumb up from AJoe.
    Uhuh. Dumb arse.
  6. Subscribermoonbus
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    20 Apr '24 20:402 edits
    @mott-the-hoople said
    cant wait till they produce the victim of this horrible crime πŸ˜‚
    The 'victims' are all the corporations which did not falsify their records and were thereby unfairly disadvantaged by the cheater.

    That is why a chess player who cheats with an engine is barred from an entire tournament, instead of having merely his one cheated-game result annulled.

    The 'victim' is the integrity of the system.
  7. Standard membermchill
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    22 Apr '24 16:042 edits
    No, it is not.

    If I or anyone else had cheated on their state or federal taxes, falsified business records, incited an armed mob to storm the Capital building, where they bashed in windows, kicked in doors, killed and injured police officers. If I had stolen government documents, then refuse to give them back despite multiple requests to do so. If I or anyone else had paid off pornstars and playmates to keep them quiet in order to suppress negative press in order to win an election. I or anyone else would have been sitting in a prison cell for at least the last 2 years - and would be staying there for a very long time.

    This man has been treated like royalty by the criminal justice system and still he snivels and whines about being victimized. For the 1st time in decades, he's in a place where he doesn't get to make all the rules and has to answer to someone besides himself. Your delay tactics have run their course, and its finally time to face a jury of your peers. So, stop crying like a little child with a broken toy and deal with it! 😏
  8. Subscribermoonbus
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    22 Apr '24 16:172 edits
    @mchill

    In order to understand Trump's oft-repeated charge that he's the victim (of a "witch-hunt" ), it helps to know something about who his mentor was.

    His mentor was Roy Cohn.

    Now, for those who are too young for that name to resonate, he was Senator Joe McCarthy's 'rotweiller', right-hand man, and legal counsel. Yes, that Senator McCarthy -- the one who instigated a 'witch-hunt' in the the 1950s. Everything Trump does in and around courtrooms , he learned from Roy Cohn: delay, prevaricate, intimidate witnesses and judges, accuse your accuser of what you did (e.g. rig an election), turn the charges upside-down and cry 'I'm the victim here! not my accuser', avoid the facts, deny responsibility, blame someone else, decry the procedure, decry the evidence, deflect, deny-deny-deny, distort the legal system against itself, automatically appeal any decision you don't like, counter-sue your accusers for quadruple the sum because they can't afford the legal fees to defend themselves against spurious charges, but under no circumstances address the facts or ever admit defeat (even when the sentence is unequivocally "you did it and you're guilty as Cain" ). All these tactics are straight out of Roy Cohn's playbook, and the whole 'witch-hunt' narrative dates to Sen. McCarthy himself.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_Cohn
  9. Standard membermchill
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    23 Apr '24 15:041 edit
    @averagejoe1 said
    A tax evasion witness.?? What has that got to do with this case? What crime was Trump trying to conceal, anyway. That has not been made clear.
    The trouble for Trump is this minefield, one slip of tongue, (and he does a lot of talking) could backfire on him, and we could lose it.
    If Biden wins, are y'all going to make us house the immigrants, legal and ille ...[text shortened]... liberalized. Everyone would indeed, at the end of the day, all end up in the same place. Brrrrrr
    I'm sure its puzzling to you Joe, but the prosecutions documented and taped evidence paints a very clear picture of fraud and election interference.
  10. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
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    18 Apr '24 15:351 edit
    @AverageJoe1
    So you know more than the DA's involved. Where did you get your legal training? Have you passed your Bar exams yet?
    Besides that, I see no comment by you about the morality of a defendant attacking juries. You see no problem with that? I guess in planet Joe1, that is the new normal.

    But of course if it was Biden under these charges and treated the jury like that, HANG THE SOB.
  11. Joined
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    19 Apr '24 07:12
    @shavixmir said
    How are bases abroad not part of a defense policy?
    the same way was pointing a gun at everyone you meet before they attack you isn't defense
  12. SubscriberSuzianne
    Misfit Queen
    Isle of Misfit Toys
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    19 Apr '24 10:41
    @averagejoe1 said
    https://www.politico.com/news/2023/09/05/biden-books-bad-sales-trump-00113793

    Seriously, who is interested in him? I think that we can definitely conclude that all presidential votes will be, quite simply, votes against Trump.
    Further, I sayeth not.
    Every post you make is further proof that you don't know what you're talking about.
  13. Standard membermchill
    Cryptic
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    19 Apr '24 14:143 edits
    @averagejoe1 said
    https://www.politico.com/news/2023/09/05/biden-books-bad-sales-trump-00113793

    Seriously, who is interested in him? I think that we can definitely conclude that all presidential votes will be, quite simply, votes against Trump.
    Further, I sayeth not.
    I'd be more concerned about the guy who's running for President in order escape multiple prison sentences, instead of who sells the most books. 😏
  14. Standard memberspruce112358
    Democracy Advocate
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    19 Apr '24 14:36
    @Mott-The-Hoople
    Maybe the same people who ate Michael Rockefeller ate Biden’s uncle. πŸ€”
  15. Subscribermoonbus
    Über-Nerd
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    20 Apr '24 09:25
    @vespin said
    We are down to 3 full pages of clans. I believe that is around 50 to 60 clans, actually less if we don't count one player clans. We use to have 120 to 180 clans I believe.
    Leaders are not playing matches, and not just with my team or Metallica, they are just sitting silent and if they do play, they argue over a 2 player vs a 3 player match as if that would have any impact a ...[text shortened]... nd clans. It's really a shame.

    All my best to everyone regardless of the situation.

    Michael
    People have come to recognise that there is not a level playing field and that certain 'tactics' skew the results. Change the framework to establish a level playing field, stop employing said 'tactics', and that might attract people back to the clan system.
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